Hands and fingers hovering on keyboard.Standing vs hovering

Your language is not good.This is a forum you should respect other people and not post such statements. Mr Fraser is helping people.It looks like you have no idea regarding piano technique or music in general.But i dont really care. What is it that you dont understad?Have you purchased mr Fraser books and dvd ? Instead of accusing people and talking like that have you tried to do even a single excerise ? Or even if you did not buy any product ,were you kind enough to ask for advice from mr Fraser ?All i see is someone accusing Mr Fraser in another thread,using foul language and bad expressions. Music is NOT playing only with fingers,there is playing with your whole self and utilizing all the resources you have.Can you post a single video of you playing something?That others could see and understand about you? Remember there are moderators and you should respect other forum members.The way you speak is inappropriate,this is not your home or your property.In your own place speak as you wish.Here there are rules and you should respect them. Regards

Oh god He knows how to have "fun"! I'm still reeling from this, maybe I'll post something of substance later

I feel so freaked and at the same time relieved now that you posted that ,when i was replying and answering regarding who are your musician friends and wether they are like you ? i was going to name Mr Gekic and tell to piano freak,that mr Fraser is a very good musician and professor and many artists (and i was going to name Mr Kemal) know him and have worked with him.On another thread i wanted to create was to have questions that would give us more information regarding mr Gekic and his plans his tours around the music world. I have to agree that taking those comments more lightly they had a certain balkan humor.I am from Greece and i can understand that.If you ever visit a greek forum,along the chats and posts these were very light People from Europe and in Balkan have sometimes different tamperament in such manners.I do to! Especially the part that speaks about African genitals seems so funny now...haha! It feels so strange,mr Kemal Gekic is one of my favorite pianists and many times i have spent literally hours watching on youtube the videos of him playing always admiring the clarity precision and the wonderful performances of him and always wishing i could be a better piano player.And seeing the videos trying to unfold some technique he may be using. Yes in that sense piano freak was right,i can not play good.And if anyone ever compares my playing to mr Gekic then there is no comparison.He is a god in music,i am just a pitty pianist. But people like mr Gekic that have that magnificent sound always are an inspiration for us,they teach us how music performance should be,and they make us appreciate the human effort that is behind. I can understand now what Heinrich Neuhaus meant in his book when he spoke of Gowdosky and how little effort it seemed that Gowdowsky used to play,everything seemed so natural but when you observed him closely you could understand what was going on behind and that the mental energy needed to do that is way much more than to play something mechanical.Just watch this video . Mr Gekic welcome to the forum.I feel shocked and happy.Happy because i consider you to be one of the best artists and musicians in piano world.People like you really do not need others to speak to them about sphincter of hand,or lumbricals or interroseus or forearm and uparm or whole body usage. Yet i am pretty sure that the way you manipulate your body and your piano is correct and efficient and this what all the other people that re not like you would want to know. I only have one question for you ,all these years i have been struggling with the bench.If i sit lower power comes but my knees are in the air and my back quickly gets high pressure,unfortunately i dont have a concert grand piano so the keyboard would be higher so i could raise bench. If i sit very high then my knees are ok,but hands are ridicusly high and i am robbed of all my power. How did you deal with the height issue?You appear to be sitting lower like Horowitz.If i sit lower i have to sit more away from the piano than when being higher.At times i feel like my stomach and chest area is compressed down and i have to constantly lift it. Kind Regards (Поштовани господине Гекић је добро да смо се упознали овде)

Garret has a huge future in the stand-up (!) comedian business- that's for sure. You know the saying there are only three kinds of pianists and obviously we can exclude the third category (bad pianists) so which one(s) is it... I've never met a true proffessional caring about anything else than the fee and the developement of the real-estate and portfolio positions hard to beleive there could be exceptions. This business is crazy and that's why we love/hate it. Have a great day!

The reason i think most of us want to discuss things such as lumbricals interroseus,forearm,arm,uparm wrist usage is that we have to and we need to.Sounds crazy? Not Imagine that you have all the musicality...I always loved music i had musical ideas,regarding dynamic control,had big hands and talent for music but something was missing inside so i could not be a miracle kid that is 10 years old and plays the dante sonata. Having musical ideas and discusing that chopin should be played that way or the other way is of no use if you can't control the outcome. Piano_freak let's say that you were my teacher and i was a gifted pianist that didn't need to pay attention much to the technical aspects,all would be ok. If my hand collapsed or the thumb and index finger were not functioning correctly no matter how good will or talk we could have regarding the emotion of music it would be useless.My technical limitations would be the brake that would not allow me to perform it in the way it is meant to be played. That's way there are different levels of performances as well as people,to someone who has large fingers you dont have to tell him how to play octaves relaxed,usually the large span helps achieve a good result.But if someone has a smaller hand then what?You simply sit down and talk about the emotion ? "YOU KNOW LISZT OCTAVES IN LES FUNERELES HAVE TO BE DRAMATIC TENSE AND AGITATED AND FAST" then what happens is that in 95% of the cases the technical limitations will kick in and no matter how much you want to talk about emotion and musical ideas,it will simply not work. The fact that you are one great virtuoso does not mean that all the other people can understand the internal function of your hand mind and thought.While you are a very professional others are none! And that is the dissapointing factor,in Greece's as well as in Great Britain shcools of music (i know that from friends) there are many professors that have not a single idea regarding the things mr Fraser mentions in his book. A good friend of mine was dissapointed in the 2nd Saint saens concerto.In the place that has some double notes 3ds and 6ths and some scale passages,she could not pass a certain point. Her teacher claimed that her 4,5 fingers were the problem because of the passage. Upon observing her play having read the books and dvd of mr Fraser i managed to find at once the limitation.Thumb and second finger interdependence thumb was in the air second was collapsing big brother thumb comes to the rescue knuckles drop tension builts and the passage is far from clear! By showing her what the thumb should be doing and the function of the metacarpals and lumbricals in maintaining a good arch and how the fingers should play that passage within an hour she was able to free herself and play that. The professor of her music school that took quite a large sum of money just for one hour of lessons had advised her to play technical exercises for thirds because of the limitation of 4,5!. I was able to fix her problem by knowing that is going on. Now if you had her would you talk to her about musical spirit and ideas in the saint sans concerto and then torture her and tell her "you have not studied enough,let your fingers bleed till you feel it ?" or would you fix her the problem the underlying one regarding the thumb usage and index finger? I protest against the idea ""you have not studied enough,let your fingers bleed till you feel it ?" because in my whole life i had music teachers and professors talk like that and i feel very angry.... They talked about music and ideas,they claimed i was not musical and did not think musical,yet i had the musical ideas,music was inside me...!but they didn't help me regarding my technical limitations,regarding the arch the thumb,the cobra strike technique...they paid no attention wether in a scale my arch is ok or not ,or wether i had tension when i play chopin etude op 10 no 1 or 2. Just musical advice with no help regarding the real problems. Their technical advice,to study mechanical exercises and study for hours. Like torturing a man that cannot reach when he jumps in the pole 5 meters,and you say "HEY JUMP TO 6 METERS THEN 5 METERS WILL BE OK FOR YOU". Now that is plain dangerous to hurt yourself,if you can't manage the jump to 5 meters you have to lower it untill you feel comfortable ,and then you raise it little by little always trying to feel you are comfortable with the jump . I suffered in the hands of an arm weight teacher for 2 years,all my musical ideas were F*ck*d up.She insisted on the up and down of the wrist feel the hand empty and only feel like you raise the wrist the other hand should be empty!. This is crap,i was analytical i felt my self,i knew that every lifting of the apparatus was done with other things that i could not isolate,raising the wrist involves other muscles in forearm and the active role of uparm,let's not talk about the shoulder.No that was arm weight,studying chopin op 10 no 4 with every note slowly with the wrist going down,then study groups of notes,2 notes wrist down 2 notes up.Then speed it up. That was TORTURE!!!Music and technique were seperated. For my case when i found mr Fraser books or other material (i have been collecting piano books for years),it made me fly.My music got better,my arpegios are smooth with no need to sit on black man's genitals like you said.I feel the difference i can now understand the musical terms,if someone talks to me regarding musical ideas i can fulfil them and do them because my understanding behind the way sound is created is ok. Don't assume that because you were gifted with a blazing technique and mind that can do wonders with the hands that all others can do it.Don't assume that because you only need musical advice that other people can do it like you. What would you say to someone that has the musical ideas,and desire yet there is something bad...Would you talk regarding the thunders and aggresiveness of some of Prokoffievs style or would you try to fix a bad car that the machine has not good oil?. Would you tell to someone that has a car that can reach 50km,ok in this passage it is absolutely essential for the beauty of music to reach 300km we are at the skies like in a spaceship watching the universe?. For god's sake no...it would not work.Fantasy is something,inner listening is something but a malfunctioning hand no matter how much desire we have won't produce the effects of a good hand that is organized and knows what to do. I believe in the synthesis of the 2 worlds.Music that is created by a hand that can function musically.Technique alone is nothing,like some crazy modern piano pieces badly composed at times and even more badly performed,with clusters and horrific sounds making nosense to the ear. Music ideas are ok but all will laugh with someone that makes mistakes or slows down on the Rachmaninov 3rd concerto even if he has 500% musicality. I hope you can understand what i am trying to say Kind regards

Dear Nikko, Thank you for your detailed mail. I feel for your plight...it is pity you suffered so much under hands of incompetent teachers, and I am glad you found your way through teaching of Mr.Fraser. I myself have high esteem for Mr.Fraser's energy. I wish I could help you, however, i am not a piano virtuoso. Although I dedicated my life to music, and spent most of it actually collaborating with many musicians,playing piano, harpsichord and organ. I also taught for a short time, but that was quite long ago. I am also proficient on viola and hautbois, but keyboards are my main thing. I understand what you are trying to explain regarding your physical limitations. You did not need to go at such length about it because it is very clear. However , I would like to tell you that maybe all that is imaginary. The hand is controlled by brain, and if your hand does not obey you despite significant effort you put into controlling it over years, then maybe you should seek solution elsewhere (but NOT pelvis, sphincter etc). The answer is in your psychological and neurological response. i believe you are a healthy individual, and probably you can use your hands to perform successfully a number of other tasks, such as unbuttoning your shirt, holding a fork or spoon. The fact that you can not do what you want at piano points more to your complicated history of your relationship with instrument, music, school, teachers and ultimately with yourself. Now I feel sorry I lashed out at you, because you are just a seeker after improvement, like so many people. At first, I thought you are one of those posters-eternal whiners who drain Mr.Fraser with nonsense, but now you seem to be sincere. Please consider what I wrote above. i do encourage you to continue working with Mr.fraser, who seems to be a honest individual,(now I see it differently- the way he responded to my post filled me with respect for him) but also please consider that the secret is locked inside your own brain. If you manage to disable those barriers, new world may be waiting for you to discover. Best wishes, Garnett

By the way, I was amused to read your mail to Mr.Gekic. If you really have such a high esteem for him, why didn't you contact him directly? I don't know much about him, except from Mr.Fraser's book, and also I heard some of his recordings and live from NPR.He did not play recently in Chicago area where I spend most of my time. best regards, Garnett

Just to let newcomers to this thread know that I have deleted several offensive posts from the thread - thus some of the posts still visible don't make complete sense; they refer to something you can no longer read... I had to delete them because we really won't tolerate offensive language or opinions here - however, I grateful for the very stimulating discussion about music vs. physical concerns that has evolved because of them! Thanks to all concerned! AFF

Like a Jungian synchronization this week I encountered what all is in the brain means. I was supposed to contribute to a soundtrack about old pianos. Another guy- an autist was there as well. Contrary to many "idiots savants" as you can't say anymore the touch was unbeleivably beautiful he had rythm and was a nice chap. He could play almost anything after hearing a piece once.He could play any fuge in the wholtemperierte in any tonality-avista. He could improvise on any theme ad infinitum without repeating a pattern. Never gave technique one single thought. Never praticed as most people do repeating passages over and over again. He couldn't explain what he was doing but I think everything he did originated from mental activities.For him thinking and playing was equal. Playing was more a way to entertain otehrs and get some symphaty. I felt like a complete fake a dumb beginner and to be honest this experience really forced me to question the purpose of the whole thing.This guy was in his daily life a humble organist in a small village. So whatever methods we use the point in this thread to never forget that muscle in the scull really made sence to me-in a somehow brutal way.

Amazing story! Yes, that 'muscle' in the skull is really at the base of it all... Your key phrase is "thinking and playing are equal." That hits the nail on the head... Sometimes I wish we were all a little more autistic! In 'defense' of everything we're investigating here, when I play my best and do everything I talk about and teach, that exact experience results: my fingers express my thoughts with nothing intervening. And my fascination with the physical, from a Feldenkrais point of view, is indeed a fascination with that huge part of the brain responsible for organizing movement. Movement is indeed thought, but we don't behave as if this is so. I see our work as joining these two processes which somehow have become separated in our perception... Thanks for that wonderful anecdote! AFF