Examples Of Non-skeletal Playing?

Alan, Could you point out an example of somebody who plays in a way that you would call "non-skeletal". (Hopefully somebody who does a good job . ) Many of the analysis of specific players in this forum end up saying something like: "very shallow arc, but it is still there...". So, if everyone plays skellitally, what is the point of the distinction? Thanks, ocd

whew, a good question! I'll have to take a look around and get back to you, OK? AFF

So far nothing. People only put stuff on YouTube that is pretty good! But I remember seeing pianists play non-skeletally, plenty of times. See my blog post last winter about the competition where you could tell how good/bad their sound was, simply by observing how much/how little arch they had. I have had students who even had a hyper-collapsed metacarpal-phalangeal ridge. They could still play but with a small sound. I have seen so many Japanese students play like this, especially female, that I ended up calling it "Japanese Syndrome." This I would call non-skeletal. But I can't find any examples on YouTube! Will keep trying - anyone else out there care to submit something? AFF

I'll give it a shot I've found this, which I'd consider just about the antithesis of skelitality: , you can hear all the tension even through the sound of an electronic keyboard, and you can witness it just as clearly with your eyes!

YES!!! This is perfect! It is very interesting to see that the guy does not lack fingers! They are active and energetic, not lifeless. And yet they don't do the job! The impression of his playing and the look of his hand is not of someone totally clueless, but someone whose active fingers one would expect to perform better than they do. But that collapsed arch ROBS him of the result one would expect from the good work of his fingers, and thus the etude is a mess. In other words, the good work of his muscles is all for nought, because it is not supported by potent bone alignment. Thanks for posting this, and also thanks to the guy who posted his etude - we can all learn from it and I hope he can too! AFF

Oh my! hurt ears, hands, eyes, arms, head, sick at my stomach: what is it? I'd would have never guess Chopin--perhaps a very bad Dave Brubeck? I think I was wincing through the entire piece. as well as shuddering. As Alan says, it's a mess. How can anyone who has ever touched a keyboard, wind up playing==strike that--mangeling, the body, hands, music, musicality, such as this? In a way I have to feel sad for him. He must want to play but must have never had a teacher, nor just let his hands be natural and observe the shape? Thanks for the url. Thanks Alan for your comments. There really isn't much that can be said in a case like this, except a dismal, "oh, no!" Bob

Bob, I venture to disagree! As you see in my reply, my feeling is that all is not lost. If he could understand the structural concepts that I use as a context for discussing his playing, he could very well improve. He does not lack musical ability, he lacks information. I know it is tempting to dismiss something as problematic as this as hopeless, but I very rarely ever do so - I always am reminded of Moshe Feldenkrais's words, 'There is no limit to improvement,' and it's on that basis that I make my analysis... Thanks for provoking this response, it is something important that we need to think about! AFF

Hi! Found this on Youtube any comments? E

Another great video to discuss. He plays wonderfully, and yet you see the collapsed knuckles, especially of the right hand second finger. What's going on here!? I am reminded also of Kemal at certain moments who also does something like this. How can I explain it: the shortest distance between two points is a straight line, and if two adjacent fingers (or thumb) have to join a certain two keys, the most convenient way to do it might not necessarily cultivate the maintenance of the hand's arch. These guys have the reflexes and the muscular development to manipulate the key the way they want even though they go against certain principles of skeletal leverage. If you hooked him up to Kathleen Riley's equipment you would probably find "higher than optimal" levels of tension, but my feeling is that if this is the best way for him, more power to him! It seems to be working so well that he is not even causing himself any physical problems. If he ever DID develop problems, we would "know why" and have a possible solution at hand, but as I said, the playing is pretty great as it stands... There is even something "boney" about his sound; he does get that "skeletal bone knock" health into his sound to some extent even though he's not using all the angles to greatest efficiency. Very interesting to delve into this! I will think about this some more... AFF

There is another one on youtube with Peter Nero playing Chop op10Nr1 even more confusing to me. A lot of jazzpianists play like this I really envy them this relaxed sort of playing so uncommon among the classicals. Relaxation has of course nothing to do with collapsing knuckles. Is this maybe a kind of armweight-school? Nero uses microphones all the time his sound is probably totally adapted to recording.So he doesn t need the same coloration toolkit as a big-hall accoutic performer does. I bet that if you heard this live with real accustics and with Horowitz playing next you would hear a big difference of which more or less might escape the micphones. Nero plays beautifully this is no critic just curiosity! Eric